Episode 75
Walk or Fly with Ian Rush The Automation Nerd
Unleashing the Potential of Automation with Millennial Engineer Ian Rush
Are you geared up for a deep dive into the nuts and bolts of automation in the manufacturing world? We chat with Ian Rush, a millennial engineer about his journey – from his early days in engineering to navigating the switch to the assembly line, all while dealing with the rise of automation and its impact on the supply chain hustle.
We're talking about the importance of staying humble, showing respect, and building solid relationships, even when you're knee-deep in uncharted territory. Ian talks about how he tackled new roles and is able to navigate operators, stakeholders, and managers. All while keeping projects in scope and on time.
How is automation affecting manufacturing? Ian breaks it down and how it can make life easier, the skills you need to bring to the table, and the real value that operators bring to the mix. Picture a world where automation kicks out the boring stuff, amps up managerial skills, and shines a spotlight on understanding cycle times for a slick operation.
Highlights
5:23 - How sometimes your dreams are not what you really want and being ok with letting them go.
6:29 - Don’t let your title stop you from learning from everyone on the team.
15:50 - How building rapport can get buy in when things change in a company.
20:25 - Automation doesn’t take away jobs but removes the boring and mundane task and allows people to enjoy their work more.
Contact your host
Steve Doyle:
Brad Herda:
Connect with Ian:
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Transcript
to show Brad Herter how you doing today.
Brad Herda (:I am Wunder from Mr. Doyle. It is a great day here in the state of Wisconsin. It hasn't rained in like a freaking month, which I think is driving people crazy here. I think it's really getting people's nerves. The summer, it's not a traditional summer. It's been warm, hot, sunny like Florida, and we're not used to that here. We haven't gotten the cold, we haven't gotten the rain, and I think people are getting stir crazy with that type of weather.
Steve (:WHAT?!
Steve (:I would have never thought that would create people to be stir crazy there. I just thought they were always crazy. So we'll just.
Brad Herda (:Right we are we are we are how things going in the Detroit neck of the woods football season is coming upon us pre seasons here. I mean come on.
Steve (:You know?
Preseason is here, finally. Preseason is here. So, you know, it's interesting. Somebody that lives in Wisconsin is a Lions fan. Someone that lives in Michigan is not a Lions fan. Kind of think that's really interesting. Sympathy. Yeah. So, Brad, who do we got on the show today?
Brad Herda (:now.
It's okay. I get lots of sympathy all the time from my packer friends and bears friends around here. Yeah, they're like, oh we're sorry Okay, whatever
Ian Rush (:Ha ha.
Brad Herda (:So today we have Ian Rush on the show and his area of awesomeness, right? He is deals with the scope and execution of automation projects. His strength is when he needs to get that shit done ASAP. He gets it done. He is working on scaling automation inside of America so that we can, from my perception,
bring in younger talent to not do mundane stupid shit so they can bring more value to their organizations. And we are very pleased to have Ian on today's show. Welcome Ian.
Ian Rush (:Thank you, it's a pleasure to be here. Appreciate the invite.
Steve (:Awesome!
Brad Herda (:Did I kind of get that right on the automation piece is what you're trying to do here?
Ian Rush (:Yeah, you said it great. I'm right. I wrote down a few of those because I'm like, that sounds better than the way I say it, sure.
Steve (:That's awesome. So before we get started, Ian, can you let us know which generation you fit in with?
Ian Rush (:I am a millennial, just barely. Born in 89. Ha ha ha.
Steve (:ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Brad Herda (:So you're like Steve.
Ian Rush (:Hey, I played original Nintendo as a kid, but I did not play arcades.
Steve (:Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Brad Herda (:We're sorry to hear that.
Ian Rush (:So I remember playing Turkey Shooter, the Turkey Hunt game. I remember playing the original Mario. Yeah. So I remember when my neighbor got us.
Brad Herda (:Okay.
Steve (:Ooh!
Brad Herda (:So, so, so you didn't get, you didn't get the opportunity to go spend time in the bars with your parents on Saturday mornings or whatever, and ask for quarters.
Steve (:Yeah.
Ian Rush (:Nope. No, I was, yeah. Yeah, so Nintendo was my jam, but yeah, I'm, I don't know. I was born in 89 and I'm the youngest of four, so my four siblings made sure that I was properly indoctrinated with the 80s. And, you know, I was surprised when someone explained to me what I was, I was like, am I really a millennial though? Cause I don't really fit in with my people, if that's the case.
Steve (:Right?
Steve (:Yes. Yes!
Steve (:Yep.
Ian Rush (:And apparently...
Brad Herda (:And that's, and there's a lot of that. It's just, it's our, it's our way to categorize. And then we have people identify and show that, yeah, we're not in that space. And that's part of why we did this show is to be able to show, look, there are good people across all generations, across all things. So when old, funny daddies like myself go, Oh, that young kid doesn't know what they're doing. That's whatever it's, it doesn't matter. It sure that I'll go with that.
Ian Rush (:Sure.
Steve (:I was a boomer.
Ian Rush (:Funny Daddies.
Steve (:Hehehehe
Brad Herda (:It doesn't really matter what that is. It's just that there's different ways to look at life. There's different ways to solve problems. Just because I think it's one way doesn't mean your way is wrong. And that's what the show is kind of all about. So as you've got, how did you get into the automation space to be the self-proclaimed automation nerd in the industry?
Ian Rush (:Hehehehe
Ian Rush (:That's a great question. I actually started as a, obviously I got a degree in engineering. I went to Minnesota State, Mankato. I studied automotive engineering there. I thought for sure when I stepped off to college that I was going to be designing cars. I have a passion for cars. I think they're awesome. They're my porn, so to speak. That's why I spend my time looking at it all.
Steve (:hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
Brad Herda (:Hahaha!
Ian Rush (:But like, the more I got to know that industry, the more, you know, it really just wasn't for me, no offense, Steve, but like just Detroit and then the culture there, really around the car industry just was not what I thought it would be. And so, you know, my first actual job as an engineer was, I actually started as an intern while I was still in school. I worked at 3M and, you know, I have the good fortune of working on several.
Steve (:Yeah?
Ian Rush (:projects while I was still in college. My official senior design project was just a project from work. So by the time I actually presented it, it was actually old news at work. I remember presenting on my senior design project in college and being like, I felt kind of like the salty old guy that had been around a while because all these late kids had never even worked yet.
Brad Herda (:You weren't the Post-it Note guy, were you?
Steve (:Hahaha
Ian Rush (:I had to take time out of my day to come do this presentation. I got to go back to work after. So that was my, long story short, that was my indoctrination is my very first big project at 3M was an automated project. It involved several different systems being used to solve a problem, saved the company a bunch of money, they were able to move an entire line back to where it came from, which saved them a lot of money on supply chain, things like that.
So that felt really good. And then that, when I graduated, they, uh, gave me my first real line. So at that time I was just an intern. So I was just running around being everybody's, uh, project, uh, um.
Steve (:Project Assistant or you want to say the real word? Say it! Project Assistant or you want to say the real word? Say it! Project Assistant or you want to say the real word? Say it! Project Assistant or you want to say the real word?
Brad Herda (:Peace.
Ian Rush (:I want to say the real word, but we don't know where this is going to end up. So I spent a lot of time, just obviously being the newbie, you got to kind of earn your stripes. And so I would just kind of roam around, work the line with the operators and learn it, try to find some problem that had existed for years. And I'm like, I'm the guy who's going to solve that problem. And because I took the time to make friends with the operators, they would help me solve it and be like, okay, what you need to do? Or like, it just needs to do this.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:And so when I moved to Menominee, Wisconsin, I got my first real line and I took all that there and immediately kicked off several automation projects and had quite a bit of success right away and just figured out right away, you know, my super power, like it says on my LinkedIn is really just more the project management of it. Like there's a certain nuance to automation.
And it requires, I mean, there's certainly, you know, project management in and of itself is a career path. But like automation is very nuanced. So, you know, I learned very quickly what it took to get a project across the goal line, especially in corporate America, where it takes, you know, 35 signatures to spend a dollar. So that was, you know, that's how I got into it, was, you know, learning how the businesses work in terms of getting money approved, which I got really, really good at.
Brad Herda (:forever.
Steve (:Right?
Ian Rush (:Um, so allowed me to work on the projects I wanted to work on and then, you know, learning how to scope out projects efficiently and, and sticking to the scope, um, which would be something I probably repeat four or five times.
Brad Herda (:Well, hey, hold on. Time out. Time out. Time out. Time out. I'm, I'm throwing the bullshit flag project sticking this. Come on, let's come on. We all come on. There has to be some scope creep along the way. We just can't do what we said we're going to do. Somebody's got to change it for you halfway through and go No, no, no. We'd like to go from three ounces to five ounces.
Steve (:Time out. Time stop.
Ian Rush (:Okay, okay.
Ian Rush (:Hehehe
Brad Herda (:Can we just make it? Right.
Ian Rush (:And then they ask why it isn't done yet Mr. Rush this was supposed to be done six months ago. Why are we still working on this project?
Steve (:Yeah!
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:because you keep changing the darn scope on me. That's why.
Ian Rush (:Quit moving the goalpost on me coach.
Steve (:Yeah, that's right. So one of the things you said there, Ian, is if we back up a couple minutes ago, you said you made friends with the operators. So since we're a generation show, talk to us a little bit about that interaction when you're coming in as the FNG, somebody that people, when you're on the operation line, they look at you, go, you don't know shit. And how did you...
forge that relationship to then become the, you know, automation nerd.
Ian Rush (:It's a great question. I mean, first of all, I mean, I...
Ian Rush (:I'm, I am a blue, I grew up blue collar. I grew up working in factories and tire shops and earning my stripes, you know, day one on the job, you're just sweeping or you're holding the paint bucket or whatever it is, you know, whatever the hazing is for that job. Um.
Steve (:muffler bearings, got it. Yeah, muffler bearings, liquor fluid, all that fun stuff, got it.
Ian Rush (:Yeah, you know, rotor wash and fucking flight line and stuff like that. So, um, I, and I did some, I, so, I mean, really I, I was very accustomed to that journey of like earning my stripes. Um, and I don't see myself above anybody. The reason I went into engineering is cause it interested me. Um, you know, I grew up around the Marine Corps. My, my dad did 23 years. He retired when I was nine. Um,
Brad Herda (:Elbow grease. Don't forget the elbow grease.
Ian Rush (:And one of the things he always said was like, we lived on Camp Pendleton, watched helicopters flying, and he'd always point up and be like, you know why I'm always walking and those dudes are always flying? It's because they went to college. And he's like, he would always harp on that. And so he's like, you're gonna go to college. If you choose to walk, that's up to you. But that was always his thing. So, going to college wasn't really a choice. So it was more about picking something I was interested in. So I went into engineering.
Cause I love taking things apart. I was the kid when I was a kid, I would, you know, if a radio would break or something, I'd break, I'd take it apart, try to figure out why it broke. Even if I had no hope of getting it back together, but I had to know why it broke. And yeah, so I mean, just in terms of that conversation, I mean, I can, I relate to a lot of people. I spend time on the floor. It's one thing that it's actually got me in trouble as an engineer. Like when I go back up to the office and I'm covered in dirt.
Steve (:I'm sorry.
Ian Rush (:Or like, I worked at a semi tractor manufacturer for a while and the frame rails of a semi trailer are coated in this like, disgusting goop shit. Like it's this black tar stuff, it's disgusting. And so like when you go out there and work for five minutes, you end up covered in it. So I was like, fuck it, I'm just gonna get dirty. I'm just gonna do the job. So over the course of my first six months, like.
Brad Herda (:Goop. Sticky Goop.
Steve (:Yeah. Yup.
Ian Rush (:I would spend, there's eight stations on that line. I'd spend every day of the week, I would kind of work my way around. And there were certain stations, there was kind of no point in working. Like some stations just did like one thing. So I didn't really need to work it, like drill that hole 500 times, you know? But some, you know, certain stations, there were like five or six processes happening at once. And certainly those represented the bottlenecks and where, you know, the most likely place to have a project would be. And just honestly, right away,
Steve (:Yep.
Ian Rush (:It shocked a lot of people that I was even out there, let alone holding a wrench, which again, I don't see myself as above anybody, which I believe is why I've been successful. It's not because I'm smarter. It's not because I have some crazy degree from some Ivy League school. I went to an average Joe State-run school, nothing special.
Brad Herda (:Well, come on, they got a great hockey program at Mankato. Let's be honest. There's studs there.
Ian Rush (:They do they do the Mavericks they know how to play hockey and that's not a dig on MSU. It's just you know Apparently there's a stigma amongst my peers that I've had to overcome in every role and so by the time I got to you know, I Started as an engineer as an intern excuse me at 3m. So by the time I got to my line At my nominee I'd have been there two and a half years. So I kind of knew how 3m works I really didn't have to worry about like learning the politics and things like that
Steve (:Eh.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:So I just focused on my line. I really wanted to succeed. Frankly, it was a stretch for me. I had no idea what, like they didn't tell me what line I was being hired for when they interviewed me. So I didn't like lie. But like when they threw me on the line, I was like, this is not anywhere close to in my wheelhouse. Like I'm an engineer, but like this is some space grade stuff here. I've known nothing about. So, you know, there was definitely a learning curve on that, but I learned very quickly that the operators know what they're doing. Like
Steve (:Hehehehehehe
Ian Rush (:They've been doing this for years. Like they understand the process. Like engineers often operate in a bubble, in a silo. And honestly, it's not a vindictive thing. I've worked with a lot.
Brad Herda (:No.
Steve (:Oh, come on. Sorry, I'm a fellow engineer. It's okay. I'm a recovering engineer. It's okay. Well, it's already on. See, it's animated. I got it.
Brad Herda (:Just so you know, Steve's a recovering engineer, just so you know.
Ian Rush (:Get your bullshit meter ready, because I'm pretty sure this is... Because I mean, I don't think engineers mean to be the way they are. It's just personality thing. The kind of person who gravitates towards that career, you know, kind of has those attributes.
Steve (:Yup.
Ian Rush (:And I don't want to be that guy, basically. I'm social, I don't necessarily need to be everyone's friend at work, but I want to at least be accepted and be seen as a part of the team. Yeah, I'll say one last thing, also just working on the projects the operators want to work on. Because a lot of times I walk up, I'm working the line, I've been there for a few months, we're shooting this shit, we're on a first name basis. And then I kind of probe about ideas, like I throw ideas, just throw them out there. Like, hey, what if we build this?
and I kind of just take the temperature of the wine, like if everyone's like, fuck that idea, it's stupid. So like, I'm like, okay, we're not gonna work on that idea yet. So, yeah. So I hope that answers your question.
Brad Herda (:And George tells you to go George tells you to go get bent
Steve (:Yep.
Steve (:Yeah.
Brad Herda (:We're not ready for that one yet.
Brad Herda (:So, yeah. So, all right, you're the automation guy. You go through, you find opportunities, you talk to the workers on the floor about what they'd like to do, what they'd like to see happen. So then when it actually does happen and their job changes in some way, shape or form, they're no longer doing the thing they hated every day, even though they say they hated it, but it's a change now for them.
How do you, how are you going through that change management piece with them to facilitate the, that older worker to say, oh, we're changing your job through this. How did you help facilitate that in that automation space to get them to see the value of not doing the same thing a thousand times over and over and over.
Steve (:Yeah, I agree.
Ian Rush (:Yeah, I love that question. First of all, a big part of it is the rapport that I built before even beginning the project and using that rapport to get those individuals to participate in the project. And I go as far as I'll make sure that, like in every group there's always your, we always talk about leaders, but no one ever talks about like stakeholders and influencers within a group.
Brad Herda (:Correct.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:And I believe you can impact the whole group, but you don't just have to focus on the kernel, right? Because anyone who knows better, knows that there's a few other echelons you really need to get buy-in from if you want things to go your way. So, use that rapport, work with the influencers, and get them and definitely stakeholders. Like people who's, like if the one guy who says, screw the boss, and everybody agrees, you wanna get that person as an ally early on.
Steve (:Yeah.
Ian Rush (:and then get them to, like, I literally would take them to, like, the, we call them FATs, factor acceptance tests. So, like, as the project progresses, the vendor will take, bring you on site, they'll buy you lunch, all that, they'll smooth you and all that, which is great. Good perk to the job. And then they're, the whole point of it is, they show you, like, what the machine is doing, so you get an idea of what it's gonna do on the flip side. Maybe you bring in some parts and you test it, and then they're trying to make sure that,
Steve (:Yup.
Ian Rush (:you have confidence in it when it arrives. Like, yep, it worked before it got here. And so, you know, exactly. Yeah, it's like, oh, we're not gonna do 100, we're gonna do 1,000, we're gonna do 10,000 or whatever it takes. And, you know, from an engineering side and from a corporate side is I make sure I get enough money in the budget to do that, to do the tests correctly, because my projects work when they show up. And they work because I...
Brad Herda (:Yeah, that's where you go to try to break it.
Ian Rush (:I get the money approved early to make sure I can afford to do the testing that's necessary to ensure that. Yeah, so that and then, again, having those people accompany you and not just like, hey, this is my buddy on my field trip with me. It's like this person, they have an assignment, they're there to participate and then I make them feel like their opinion of like this test is what matters to me. Like I've, if that makes sense, like I make sure that the...
culture of that event is such that the operators that I bring with me, I'm bringing them, like almost like I'm the vendor, I'm dragging them along and I'm participating in the schmooze. Because ultimately I need them to like this project, I need them to point out things that are dumb before it arrives at the dock ready to be installed.
Brad Herda (:Stop it. See, then they can't, if they're involved, if they're involved and they give you acceptance, they can't blame you then, Ian.
Steve (:But I still watch them. Right.
Ian Rush (:That's true. And then that's the hope. I mean, there's still there's yeah, that's the hope. And so far I've had really Yeah, so that is that is the hope and I've seen it go both ways. And I, I believe my way is the better one because you know, my numbers prove it but you know, the systems that I've, what's that?
Steve (:Hahaha
Steve (:Broken like a boomer. We love the compliments.
Brad Herda (:There's some truth to that.
Ian Rush (:Hahaha
Steve (:I'm gonna go.
Brad Herda (:So how, as automation is coming in and job roles are changing in the factories, um, what are some of the things you see as a barrier with automation coming in for bringing in the Gen Z that 26 and younger crowd? Uh, what are some of the opportunities that, um, automation has to energize or excite youth into getting into manufacturing?
Ian Rush (:I'll say two things. Number one, working with a robot or alongside a robot or an automated system that involves a robot, I think is a lot of fun. Again, I'm a nerd, so I might have a different opinion on things. But once you've done it, the robot should, done correctly, eliminate the mundane part of the job so you can focus on the cool part. If that makes sense, it should give you a nice tempo, a nice pace. I don't know. Every time I've implemented some form of a robotic system, I...
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:the operators always comment during install and during run-up about the, like how it just like, it simplifies their job. And then on the flip side, there's a certain technical acumen necessary to actually work with systems, around systems like that as an operator. So in every instance that I've participated in, there's been a significant salary increase.
You know, within, you know, whatever the regular cycle is for income increases at an organization. You know, I've participated in those conversations before, during, and after the implementation of, you know, automation projects. And it's fascinating to watch even management, like upper management, the way they see a job, like the value that an operator brings when there's like technology involved in them doing their job versus, you know,
Let's say you're stuffing envelopes for a living, which is a job that a lot of people do in factories around the world. You know, like the robot can't do the whole job. Frankly, it's possible, but it's very, very costly and it's not very reliable. Humans are great at certain parts of that job. And if you eliminate the stupid parts, then it's not so bad of a job. You know, it's kind of interesting. So that'd be the first one is.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:How do I get rid of my boss? He's the stupid part. Can you automate that out, Ian?
Steve (:Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Steve (:Sure.
Ian Rush (:I will say that I think bosses will get better when you can point to a machine when things go wrong and set up a person. That's one of my selling points when I'm selling automation to operators and management as a whole is if you can point to the process and say, this is what went wrong and you eliminate the human element. I mean, there's humans involved, but like you humans are trying to execute the process that's documented. The boss is beating his chest about the process. His or her chest about the process.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:So it's like, okay, well boss, your process says, do this, then this, and I did it, and here's the outcome, then go fix your process, becomes the conversation. So it eliminates the emotion from it, and I think it results in much better, obviously cohesion, but also results.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:I love the documentation. I love that, right? Cause that, cause that the robot, the automation piece will only do what you tell it to do. It's only as good as its inputs, right? You're only, it will give you the output every single time based on the inputs you give it. And that part of it is the, that's the part that many organizations just struggle with. They just want to say, okay, just make it happen. Well, you just.
Ian Rush (:Mm-hmm.
Steve (:Right?
Brad Herda (:Automation isn't just poof, all of a sudden here it is. I got a product that comes out the end because we just put automation lines and you still have to
you know, eliminate some things, maybe change some things, possibly understand what your cycle times really can be. Because, right, you could make the machine go 10 times faster. But if you have no place to put the product, the machines kicking out because the humans the next piece in line, it doesn't really matter.
Ian Rush (:Yeah, I've seen it.
Brad Herda (:I mean, there's lots of cool shit that you're working on. That's awesome.
Ian Rush (:Yeah. Well, thank you. I mean, so I guess that was the kind of the way I said I gave you too. So the first one was more on the people who are executing the projects, like the kind of the, I'll call it the micro level, just the individuals who are, who are, you know, in the trenches. And then the other side would be in terms of a barrier is, you know, organizations, like automation is, is a change of architecture. It's like building a house with, you know, wood and, you know, putting
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:siding on it versus, you know, if you're going to intend to put a stucco on it, it's a completely different architecture, right? I mean, it doesn't necessarily take any longer to do either one, but there's, there's a, you have to approach building the house knowing that because there's a, there's, there's different things going different places and with automation, a lot of times what I've seen is, you know, the ideas and the execution is all coming from the bottom up and management. At very.
Management gets the say, the final say. And a lot of times management, people who are in management have very finance heavy backgrounds, accounting, finance, maybe some team management. So they're very, so they, you know, so when you start bringing in these really technical things, they don't see the buy-in. Like it's hard to get them to buy in on something they don't understand. And so I would,
Steve (:Weird.
Steve (:Thank you.
Ian Rush (:The solution or the approach I've been taking with some success is trying to work from the top down at my level. Because I know once I get on the floor, finding projects and executing them, that's the easy part. I've done it. I know how to do my job in that regard. But getting the right people to buy in on the right things and to free up resources, not just money, resources. Like they need to assign people to this project because someone's going to own it after I leave.
You know, like, I'm not sticking around and putting in 30 years here. Like, y'all can't afford me for that. So it's like, that's not to be cocky. It's just, I'm not gonna do the, you know, yeah. But like, you know, I'm sure you guys have seen it. Like someone implements some new thing and like they have a team of gurus come in and help and then they leave and the whole thing falls on its face because...
Steve (:Yep.
Steve (:Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Brad Herda (:It's just true. It's not cocky if it's true. It's okay.
Ian Rush (:Nobody learned it, you know, no one was there to support it. So.
Brad Herda (:better yet is you use the gurus, you put together a whole system in place, you get acquired in the middle of it, and then nobody likes the new way of doing it. So we're going to do it the old shitty way that we've been doing it for 40 years. That's always fun too, and very demoralizing. That's a blast also.
Steve (:Yep.
Ian Rush (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:Or you end up using both you have the new system that you use sorta Sometimes and then you're still referring to the old system to get information Then you're dumping it in the new system and then you're bringing it back to the old system. Yeah It can get real gross real quick
Steve (:BLEH HEH
Brad Herda (:That's true.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Steve (:So one question that I have for you is, as you're working with all these companies on their automation, what would be one suggestion that you have for them that would aid in attracting the younger talent?
Ian Rush (:Are you saying for overall at the macro level, like the entire organization? Sure. So when I worked at 3M, one of the things I learned was that when they moved to Menominee to open that factory, they sent their recruiting team to the schools in the area. Like they went in like 30 miles in every direction and they recruited kids right out of high school. And they're like, look, you can go to college if you want, but if that's not in your future, if that's not in your...
Steve (:Yeah, just in general. It's just a general, yep, general question.
Ian Rush (:You're just come work for us. We'll teach you. We'll give you these trades and you're going to make more than anyone in town. We're going to take good care of your great benefits. And like a lot of the people I worked with, a lot of my stakeholders, I was talking about before I've been around for like, I think 33 years, which happened to be the exact age of that factory. Um, and a lot of them were there through multiple generations of my line, but also lines that had come and gone. Um, lines at 3M was into, you know,
20 years ago that fizzled out. So honestly, I think that the majority of the younger generation is being educated for life 100 years ago. Like the world has come a long way in 50 years, let alone 100, and they don't leave high school prepared.
to even learn what I'm talking about, but they have at least the basic fundamentals. And in the old days, I mean, like the generation I'm speaking about. But there was a time when companies like IBM, Motorola, Boeing, Lockheed, Intel, they would bring people out of school and say, hey, go to college if you want, or you can come do on this career path. And there was education steps along that way.
Brad Herda (:Hey, careful, careful. Be very careful.
Steve (:The bloomer, I'll take offense.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:apprenticeships and things like that where they would give them they'd pay them more than they were actually worth at the time right they overpay them a little bit to You know because they're committing to this like two-year program right when in the end they're only going to be useful at that company And then when they get to the end of that course or that time they have a great job waiting for them So in terms and my opinion of it, and I'm still working on this one. It's something that I think a lot about
Brad Herda (:Correct.
Ian Rush (:is, especially the enterprises, like big, large corporations, they have the bandwidth to do this, they have resources internally to train, they already have people that are experts on topics. And especially when you look at the aging generation that's in the process of retiring over the next 10 years, you can't bring in one person six months before they leave and expect them to pick up 35 years of experience.
Steve (:Oh, come on!
Brad Herda (:Okay Ian okay we're just gonna call see this is where you millennials think that it's like oh we can't learn anything. We can't figure out 35 years of information in six months it happens all the time what are you talking about?
Steve (:R.I.P.
Steve (:Yeah, all the time! Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Ian Rush (:Hehehe
I mean, so yeah, I mean, I don't know. I mean, there's definitely something to be said for bringing in new ideas and new cultures and diversity and things like that. I'm not downplaying that on fact, I'm encouraging it, but I do think there needs to be a systematic approach to passing of information. I mean, look at, I mean, I'll just use the military because it's something, you know, I spent my entire life around it.
Brad Herda (:It's not effective or efficient, but it happens all the time.
Steve (:Hmm.
Ian Rush (:Like the reason the military is consistently good, you know, like America wasn't just good that one year, like we're good every year, you know, and it's because we have this system in place to pass knowledge and pass experiences down the food chain. It's why a bloodstrap means something to a Marine, right? It's not just a red stripe on his pants, there's actually a significance to it. And it's that passing of tradition, it's the passing of knowledge.
Steve (:Yeah.
I'm sorry.
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Ian Rush (:that keeps our military, even with using the same generation we're talking about, you know, we're our military continues to be, you know, an outstanding fighting force. And the example for the rest of the world, immediately because of that passing of information. So that's my answer is, you know, organizations seeing that and instead of waiting for someone to get to retirement, all of a sudden want to replicate them, you know, find a way to, you know, offload that information, and it's going to take three or four people.
to replicate that one person who happens to have stuck around for 35 years, you're not gonna replace them with one other person. And why would you, and put all your eggs in one basket?
Brad Herda (:Cause we created the unicorns. We're going to try to find the unicorn. And that's where the problem exists is we're trying to go unicorn hunting. Um, so, so Ian, as, uh, as our listeners are coming through and they're thinking about their type of automation projects that they've been pondering, but they couldn't find the right guy to do it. And we happen to have the right guy on our show to go out and do these things. How would they get ahold of you, find you, uh, connect with you? Um,
Ian Rush (:Hahaha
Steve (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:embrace your nerdiness to come into their factory to solve their problems.
Ian Rush (:Hahaha
Honestly, the most efficient way is LinkedIn. I mean, yeah, it's the most efficient way. You can DM me. I'm not that famous, so I don't have to like, filter anything, yeah, maybe someday. But yeah, LinkedIn's probably the most efficient. I can, I don't know if I'm gonna put my email and my phone number on your podcast. I'm getting phone calls and third, I don't know, am I allowed to do that? Should I do that? I don't think I should do that.
Brad Herda (:Not yet.
Steve (:Yeah.
Brad Herda (:Absolutely, if you want. We don't care. You tell us how you want people to get ahold of you, that's what we tell people here. If you want LinkedIn, they're gonna ask you to get on LinkedIn. That's fine.
Steve (:Yes, I do.
Ian Rush (:Okay, we'll just... Let's just do LinkedIn. Let's just do LinkedIn for now.
Brad Herda (:And if they need the phone number and email address, just contact us because we can give it to them.
Steve (:Awesome.
Ian Rush (:Exactly, yeah, let's do that.
Ahem.
Brad Herda (:We can do it that way.
Steve (:That's awesome.
Brad Herda (:Ian, thank you so much for taking some time out of your busy schedule and sharing with us your story, your automation stories, your passion for, um, making manufacturing organizations better, stronger, faster, more nimble and receptive across all generations. So thank you for, for your time today. We really do appreciate it.
Ian Rush (:Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure.
Brad Herda (:All right, thanks.
Steve (:Yeah, thanks Ian.
