Why ‘95 Babies Might Save Your Business; Nathan Schnell

Steve Doyle (: 00:01

Welcome back to this episode of Bluecaller BS. How you doing today, Brad?

Brad Herda (: 00:05

I am fantastic Mr. Stephen Doyle. How are you and the fabulous city of Detroit, Michigan doing?

Steve Doyle (: 00:12

You know, it's, can't decide if it wants to be sunny or cloudy out today. So, but I'll take it because the snow is starting to melt, starting to become springtime here. So.

Brad Herda (: 00:22

We're getting rain snow mix today. So that kind of sucks As much as I was hoping golfing would happen sooner rather than later We've got some snow last week and then cold again. Damn it. So we gotta wait

Steve Doyle (: 00:25

Good for you.

Steve Doyle (: 00:32

Right? Well, you know, it's okay. It's right around the corner. It's getting close. So who do we got on the show today?

Brad Herda (: 00:40

So our guest today is Nathan Schnell. I met him through a LinkedIn connection. He's local here in Wisconsin. He has started out as a production manager to a manufacturing specialist, to a supervisor, to all the things in between. And now he is all of the all the things, owning his own business, deciding to go on his own, become the entrepreneur, become the guy that's going to lead the next generation to success. Nathan, welcome to the show.

Nathan Schnell (: 01:04

Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Steve Doyle (: 01:08

Awesome. That's what everybody does. It's all good. It's all good. So Nathan, before we get too deep into this, which generation do you fit in with identify with?

Brad Herda (: 01:09

That's what they always say. They always say that at the beginning and then for some how it just kind of fizzles. I don't know.

Nathan Schnell (: 01:23

I was born in 95, so I'm right between the two. I'm a little young, but we've had some practice.

Steve Doyle (: 01:26

Holy how? Wow.

Brad Herda (: 01:32

95, that is the end of Millennial beginning of Z.

Steve Doyle (: 01:32

You

Steve Doyle (: 01:36

You're right.

Nathan Schnell (: 01:37

Yeah, I believe that I fit in with closer to the millennial. However, I like to get my knowledge from the older generations.

Brad Herda (: 01:44

Like me.

Steve Doyle (: 01:45

Yeah, boomer. Yeah, I couldn't resist it just just rolled right off the tongue. It was kind of nice. It was kind of nice. So so Nathan, tell us tell us about your journey. Tell us how you got started.

Brad Herda (: 01:51

Wow, thanks, Nisha.

Brad Herda (: 01:55

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 02:01

Yeah, so InnoFab came across in January 25 this year, rewind a whole bunch. Probably about 15 years ago, I started working with our family in Milwaukee here out of Anchor Rack and Anchor Rack made plating racks for the manufacturing of plated parts. And I worked with the family for, I'd probably say about 10 years and then we were able to sell it.

Steve Doyle (: 02:19

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 02:29

to a larger business called the engineered products and services Inc. Epsio in Franksville, Wisconsin. So I mean, when I was working in the Inc. REC side, I was doing everything from general labor, welding and fabrication, CNC operations, I do the water jet and the CNC wire benders. And then finally I made it to management after quite a few years. So I had my hands full along the line, but I learned a lot.

Steve Doyle (: 02:33

Yep.

Steve Doyle (: 02:51

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 02:56

Right. Broke that barrier, broke that ceiling of, hey, you're doing all the things, now let's pay you to do all the things as well. Like you should have been for probably several years earlier, my guess, but that's just me hypothetically speaking.

Steve Doyle (: 02:58

Yep.

Steve Doyle (: 03:03

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 03:09

Yeah. But I mean, January of 2020 came along pretty fast and we sold it to EPSI. And when I started with them, I helped transition the business. And in that position, I was a production manager, but I also helped transfer. After two years of time, I was promoted to a manufacturing specialist. And that's where we developed a new and implemented a new process along with building materials.

Steve Doyle (: 03:25

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 03:37

So that was the complete opposite of what we had at Anchor Rack. It was a good size company with about a dozen people, but that's where it stayed. And now I was able to see how businesses ran in a larger structure. And it's incredible. So now I want to put them both together.

Steve Doyle (: 03:46

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 03:59

That is spectacular. That is super exciting that A, a young gentleman is able to go into a business, a family business and go and get that experience and knowledge and wisdom. B, a guy that is as young as you are that's gone through two acquisitions, if I heard that correctly.

Steve Doyle (: 04:00

Access.

Nathan Schnell (: 04:01

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 04:17

Just one to EPSY.

Brad Herda (: 04:18

One acquisition, okay. The one acquisition at a opportunity that most don't even pay attention to. Most of the time it's just, we're sold, no big deal, but you took advantage of that opportunity and then now you are starting your own entity. is, congratulations, sir. That is a huge win.

Steve Doyle (: 04:26

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 04:34

Thank you, I appreciate it.

Brad Herda (: 04:36

So as you've started out your own entrepreneurial journey and becoming that owner, what are some of the things that you are facing being a younger guy in industry with maybe your service partners, maybe the bankers or the suppliers or the trucking companies, things like that. What are you facing from maybe a bias or a relationship side of things with those industries or people?

Nathan Schnell (: 05:05

I think the biggest thing right now is just understanding how the business side of things work as a business owner. Because when I was younger, I was in the shop, I was sheltered by the four walls. I didn't have to deal with the bureaucracy and everything else.

Brad Herda (: 05:21

that damn door between the office and the shop. Damn.

Steve Doyle (: 05:23

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 05:24

Yeah, so I mean, I've never really had much to do with sales. And in the last two months, three months that we've been open, all I've been doing is networking and everybody that I met through networking is I mean, you meet one great person, they put you on a three more great people and it just never ends. So I would say the sales aspect was probably the hardest part for me right now.

Steve Doyle (: 05:43

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 05:50

Okay.

Steve Doyle (: 05:51

Usually the case. We're laughing, but we have a little experience in that. You know, jumping right out and going, Yay, I own a business. Wait, I have to do sales now. So it's we get to do sales. Yep. Yep. So curious now that you've now that you've broken out onto your own.

Nathan Schnell (: 05:53

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 06:07

Yeah, input keeping and running the machine.

Brad Herda (: 06:08

No, we get to do sales. We get to do sales.

Steve Doyle (: 06:20

for the first couple months here, what would you say are the biggest surprises that you've seen or had?

Nathan Schnell (: 06:28

Biggest surprise, would say. That's a question.

biggest surprises probably I come back to the people that I'm meeting. The more that I meet new people in these networking events, the more that I just remember that we're just all humans. Through this, I've had quite a bit of doubt and...

Steve Doyle (: 06:40

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 06:55

What I'm learning is sales is not a problem anymore. We should just throw sales out and just we should call it networking in a way. Because if you know somebody, it's just going to come around. And that's the biggest, that was the biggest issue for me is you think, I thought that the only way to stay keeping an income was having the sales come in, but it's just the opposite.

Steve Doyle (: 07:06

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 07:17

Mm-hmm.

Interesting. Elaborate a little bit more on that from our audience.

Nathan Schnell (: 07:25

what do mean?

Brad Herda (: 07:29

So elaborate your mind shift going from I have to sell, sell, sell in order to have a business versus maybe how you're approaching it today of letting people buy from you, meeting people, creating relationships.

Steve Doyle (: 07:31

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 07:38

You

Nathan Schnell (: 07:39

Okay, um, it brings me back to the events. I've been working with West Dallas and Wauwatosa, the commerce, and met new people through there. I, Brad, you reached out to me, it was actually probably the first couple days that the business was open. Angela Ryan was able to help me from exotic species. And that's, that's branding.

Steve Doyle (: 08:05

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 08:06

She helped me with the logo, everything to the website. So as soon as that happened, you kind of reached out and I think, Brad, you were kind of the first person that led me to the way that it's breaking out in the spider web.

which is phenomenal.

Brad Herda (: 08:24

I don't know that's a good or bad. Should I say it? Thank you, you're welcome, I guess, I don't know.

Steve Doyle (: 08:27

Yeah, yeah, there you go. Take the win when you get it.

Brad Herda (: 08:30

No, Angela's awesome, I work with her brother for his excavation company as well. So she's amazing. She's really cool.

Nathan Schnell (: 08:43

Yeah, I don't think this would have probably been possible without some of that help, to be honest. I've always just been the, you get it done in the shop, but there's so many other aspects that they all got to work together, take a small village.

Brad Herda (: 08:58

So how have you, as the business owner, as the doer, as the maker and creator of all things that happen throughout your day, how have you been able to either set aside the time, work it into the schedule, work the phone calls into while you're delivering parts, whatever that is, how have you worked all those aspects of the business into your daily routine so that nothing's getting missed?

Nathan Schnell (: 09:24

I've made it a hobby. That was one of the biggest things I was worried about is how I'm going to bring it all together. But I'm thankful that it's just me and my fellow dog, my dog Sadie. And we got a pretty open schedule. So when we have work, we have work and we have nothing going on at night. So if we just stay here, watch a movie while the machine runs, that's what we do. And then the next day we'll go deliver those parts.

Steve Doyle (: 09:27

You

Nathan Schnell (: 09:54

go to another customer trying to see if we could be of service. And just whenever the time comes around, it's kind of what I'm putting in the work so I can have a little bit of time back in someday.

Brad Herda (: 10:08

Okay, all right. So as you've gone through this, where do you think your first higher opportunity may come from? Do you think it's gonna be on the shop floor side or do you think it's gonna be on the administrative side?

Steve Doyle (: 10:19

you

Mmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 10:23

That's really exciting.

Brad Herda (: 10:25

And there's a reason to ask this question. It's on purpose. Because you're not alone in this scenario. I have this conversation a lot with many people and often it is not the right answer.

Steve Doyle (: 10:25

Yeah, yes there is.

Steve Doyle (: 10:41

So let's see.

Nathan Schnell (: 10:42

I'm having for how short of time we've been operating. I'm having a hard decision between office administrator or keeping somebody running the machine or sales. Those are my three biggest ones. Once you get the sales and the machine has to run and once you get more busy, there's a lot more paperwork and there's a lot more design. But I mean, I'm

Steve Doyle (: 10:52

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 11:05

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 11:10

I think I'm leaning towards an operator of the machine.

Brad Herda (: 11:13

Hmm. Hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 11:13

Hmm. Hmm. Hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 11:16

Get thoughts on that.

Brad Herda (: 11:20

I'm gonna take a wrong answer for 500, Nathan.

Steve Doyle (: 11:23

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 11:23

Okay.

Brad Herda (: 11:25

And I guess here's here's the reason why I guess this would I would suggest that you'd look more at the admin side because Your time your time personally is far more valuable running the pieces of equipment and out selling than it is Writing up a purchase order doing an invoice creating a shop order doing all those other things Because let's just say you wanted to make let's just say you're pulling a hundred grand a year

$50 an hour, right? Everything you do in your business is $50 an hour. Would you pay $50 an hour for somebody to just make copies and do those things? My guess is you'll shake your hand and go, no, not at all. But the reality is that you are.

Steve Doyle (: 12:09

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 12:11

Very interesting. That's a new way to look at it. I like that.

Steve Doyle (: 12:15

Yep.

Brad Herda (: 12:16

So as much as I can appreciate, yes, I'd like to have the operator so can sell and go get it done. The admin piece will be the bane of your existence because you don't want to do it. Unless you want to be the admin person of your business, I don't get that vibe from you yet because I think you like getting dirty. I think you like being in the shop whole. I would urge you to think about

Steve Doyle (: 12:33

You're like, noooope!

Nathan Schnell (: 12:36

That's the whole reason it started.

Brad Herda (: 12:45

admin side first before you go shop floor because

It will help with all your other processes and you have somebody to do all the things that you write. Hey, hey, John or Sally, can you write this up? And by the way, can you just write out all the steps we need to do so that when I hire the operator, they know what to do next instead of you having to do it, they can support you on doing a lot of that.

Steve Doyle (: 13:06

Yep, yep, and...

Nathan Schnell (: 13:08

What's thoughts between the second person and the first

Brad Herda (: 13:12

Hey, hey, it's our show, not yours. You don't get to the questions,

Steve Doyle (: 13:13

Hey, you know what? He's taken advantage. He's taken advantage. I like it. I like it. An opportunity presents itself. So Brady put you on the spot. Answer his question.

Brad Herda (: 13:26

Absolutely. That question was directed to you, Steve. You get, get higher number two. I have higher number one. You go higher number two.

Steve Doyle (: 13:33

higher number one is always the easy one. Higher number two, sales or operations. So again, using the same analogy. Would you pay your sales guy? What do you love to do? Do you love the networking or do you love the machine operating?

Nathan Schnell (: 13:53

figure that one out yet because the networking area is brand new to me and I've been owning it right now. My first instinct was I've said it many times that the sales aspect is not for me but as an owner operator it sure is for me and I'm getting decent at it but I mean it's been a short time so we have a long time to go.

Steve Doyle (: 13:57

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 14:08

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 14:15

Right. So when it comes down to think of it like this, your salesperson is out interfacing with the people that essentially are signing over signing over checks for you. Your operator is in the walls. They're doing the job. They're working in your business. So as an old, when you get to the point where you don't have to wear all the hats,

There's a point where it's more advantageous as you as the owner to be working on your business versus in your business. I know you do. That's why I used it. That's why I used it. But at some point there's days when, especially if we came from a doing background, like, hey, I'm a heavy doer. I like using my hands, going and doing stuff.

Brad Herda (: 14:53

I hate that phrase. We're just a dick, Steve. That's great.

Nathan Schnell (: 14:57

I that one a lot.

Steve Doyle (: 15:12

But then there's days where it's like, I just need to get out of the doing and actually work on things. Like the strategy, where is the business headed? When are we doing that? If you, I would say if you resign yourself to being the operator, always doing the thing, it's hard to pull yourself away to work on the thing, on the business. So there's that initial conundrum we as doers have, it's like, no, I really want to do this. But then

Brad Herda (: 15:40

Oh, Steve just called. Did you notice, Nathan, that Steve just called himself a doer? Did you notice how used the word we in that statement? Go ahead, Nathan, ask him how much of the we do on this show. Go ahead, ask him, Nathan. Please be my guest. I can't wait to hear this answer.

Nathan Schnell (: 15:54

What's the answer on that?

Steve Doyle (: 15:57

You really want me to answer that Nathan? Brad does almost everything. Almost everything. Almost. You know, when I say almost, I can't give him that last 1%. I do show up. I do show up. So even when I'm sick, I show up.

Brad Herda (: 16:05

Almost, yes.

Brad Herda (: 16:10

No, because you show up. So you show up, Steve.

Nathan Schnell (: 16:13

Even when you're sick.

Brad Herda (: 16:16

Yep. Even when you're sick. So, so the book that we're getting to here is Dan Martell, Buy Back Your Time. Essentially, it's a really amazing book. It's awesome. It's a, it kind of goes through. admin, customer success would be that next piece of it, that internal communication piece, then that marketing, then that sales, then the leadership side of things. But you're still going to need the direct labor support to manage your.

your hours and output and things like that, because at the same, at the end of the day, you don't want to be there 24 seven either. At some point you need to get that life, uh, life balance, et cetera, and alignment. And you don't want, you don't want to be there 24 seven. You don't want your, your people to be there 24 seven. So it's just a matter of putting all things in place, but yes, admin first. And then I would say operations would be that I would say the customer success would be the second piece to it.

if that becomes your networking person in the business development because again, that's where you can, you meeting people and them meeting people, it's two different networks, it's two different opportunities to create scale for you guys. You may go to West Allis and Wauwatosa, that other person might be going out to the falls or out to Oconomowoc or down to Racine, Kenosha or wherever things are going. Great, because you don't want to, your.

Steve Doyle (: 17:37

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 17:40

your radius of influence because you're also doing all the machine running, you don't have four hours a day to be in a car.

for opportunity, you know?

Steve Doyle (: 17:52

So yeah, no, it's a great topic. One of the other questions I have for you, Nathan, is as a younger business owner, younger in age, but also younger in, hey, I just started something new, help our audience kind of walk through that mindset where you've finally said, you flipped the switch and said, you know what? I'm gonna do this on my own.

Nathan Schnell (: 18:21

So it helped a lot that I was able to have the, my family was behind me. We've got a very big extension of business owners within my bloodline and that kind of just by knowing that helped me a lot. what really happened towards the end of 2024, I noticed an opportunity. That opportunity was to cut components.

Steve Doyle (: 18:29

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 18:49

And nobody was really doing it or the people that were, the lead times were too high. I mean, the demand was there, so I jumped into it. And then finally, the family.

Steve Doyle (: 18:58

Hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 19:02

Excellent.

Brad Herda (: 19:02

Yeah. For everybody's problem is somebody else's opportunity, right? And kudos to you for looking for the opportunity versus, well, you know, this is going to be a problem. got to figure out. Kudos for thinking about opportunity and being in a mindset of abundance versus, holy shit, how's this going to work?

Steve Doyle (: 19:07

and

Nathan Schnell (: 19:08

Correct.

Steve Doyle (: 19:13

Yep.

Steve Doyle (: 19:21

Yeah.

Nathan Schnell (: 19:22

I think that the first opportunity of finding the first one is by far the hardest part because it brings it back to every person I meet, meet three more people and they know three people.

Steve Doyle (: 19:32

Yep. Yeah. From your your sphere of influence. Help me understand are you had mentioned you like learning from more seasoned professionals? Who are those mentors? He did, but I'm given you know, I'm giving you old farts the benefit of the doubt. The you know, who

Brad Herda (: 19:49

said older. He didn't say seasoned. He said older.

Brad Herda (: 19:55

I don't like seasoned. That's like trying to make a salad taste good. I'm sorry.

Steve Doyle (: 20:00

You know what? Salad does taste good.

Nathan Schnell (: 20:04

So there's been many ways. It's not even, it's the reason why I say older generations is because they have gone through it. They have trialed and erred.

Steve Doyle (: 20:13

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 20:16

I do trial and error, I try to try to get the three best options first. And they have been able to lead me to those three best options. Otherwise I'm taking 10 options and failing five times and you're gonna fail no matter what at times, but the odds have just been a little bit better. So in Ilfab we're actually renting a building.

Steve Doyle (: 20:23

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 20:34

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 20:41

from Reliable Plating Works. That's Jamie Malchus. He's been in the industry for a really long time. He's also got Elite Finishing LLC. And he's probably, I would probably say he's the first contact I've ever made in the manufacturing metal finishing market. Reason being is because the shop that the shop space Anchorac was in, he was the neighbor. So we were able to build product for him. And

Steve Doyle (: 20:51

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 21:01

Mm-hmm.

Nathan Schnell (: 21:12

After time, the building got vacated and he purchased it and I just needed a space and that's where I am. So he's helped me so much by just, mean, giving me a place to rent and being a sounding board. And he's just another example of one of those guys that just know everybody. So it's expanding the network.

Steve Doyle (: 21:16

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 21:33

Yeah. And that's, it's great because the connections that you're making and for our audience, what Nathan's doing is he's leveraging a network to help support him and he's not trying to do it on his own. And that's, that's the key point that, you know, I think most people kind of fail when they first start out a business is they're trying to do everything on their own. They're trying to be the super person, whether it's Superman, super woman, doesn't matter. We're trying to do too much on our own and we're not. Go ahead, Brad.

Brad Herda (: 22:00

Well, I'm also going to add that it also appears Nathan that you're not trying to sell to every person that you're meeting, instead you're trying to create a relationship to let people buy from you instead of saying, hey, I do this metalwork, can you buy something from me? you can't do it, but who do know that can buy something from me? That doesn't appear to be your MO of what you're doing, which creates a significant opportunity for others to...

Steve Doyle (: 22:09

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 22:23

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 22:28

hey, this is a good guy that's doing this other thing. I know I can't help him, but I know that these three other people might be able to, so they're willing to make the introduction, because he didn't just go out there and, you know, sales slobber all over.

Nathan Schnell (: 22:41

I will double down on that. When I first started, because I did not have any of the sales knowledge, it kind of was, hey, I have a water jet. I can cut you cut components. I can do it really fast with quality product. But I mean, I want to be not the smartest in the room. I want to surround myself by the smart people and just give them what they need to succeed.

Steve Doyle (: 22:42

sales club.

Steve Doyle (: 23:01

Mm-hmm.

Brad Herda (: 23:02

you're the smartest in this room, that's for sure.

Steve Doyle (: 23:07

Yep.

Brad Herda (: 23:08

Even though Steve went to Michigan, you're still the smartest in this room for sure.

Nathan Schnell (: 23:12

I appreciate that.

Brad Herda (: 23:16

All right, so last question here is always the best question. It's always the fun question So Steve came up with this great idea to call bite your tongue the segment called bite your tongue And essentially what we're looking for is a story or an opportunity Maybe something that is either personal or professional Where you maybe want it and could be one of your first networking events where maybe you went and said hmm Yeah, I probably shouldn't have said what I said

And then how did you either back away from it or recover from it?

Nathan Schnell (: 23:48

Awesome question. I believe I believe I'm in the middle of the recovery right now actually so So trial and error I always say that you got to do something if you don't do anything you'll be in the same position and I'm young so you just gotta you gotta fail sometimes but I had a really good relationship with the business at EPSI so

Steve Doyle (: 23:49

Yeah

Yes.

Brad Herda (: 23:56

you

Steve Doyle (: 24:06

Yep.

Nathan Schnell (: 24:17

Like I said, they were able to show me the best of both worlds. I was able to have my manufacturing experience that I got from the family and they were able to show me the whole administrative side of the business, which was awesome. I'm extremely thankful for that. But on my way out, I've never departed before and I've never opened a business and I was not good at the sales aspect yet. So it was...

Steve Doyle (: 24:30

Mm-hmm.

Steve Doyle (: 24:37

You

Nathan Schnell (: 24:45

Hey, I appreciate everything you've guys done, but I'm kind of heading out at January and we can have a good departure if you guys give me some sales and looking back on it. Damn. So like I said, I think I believe that, what? not too good. But I believe we're in the middle of it and it's salvageable.

Steve Doyle (: 25:00

You

Brad Herda (: 25:03

How'd that work? How'd that work? How'd that work out?

Steve Doyle (: 25:09

You

Nathan Schnell (: 25:15

But that's just one of the things that you live and you learn.

That's a good, that's a good segment.

Brad Herda (: 25:24

That is fantastic. So for folks that want to or have interest or want to support a young entrepreneur in the water jet metal cutting world, how do people find you, get a hold of you, go out and get a quote, how do they do that?

Nathan Schnell (: 25:41

We can be found online at InnoFabUSA.com. We got a LinkedIn presence. It's just InnoFab. And I've got my email and phone number connected to the LinkedIn and the website. If anybody needs a quote, it's right there.

Brad Herda (: 25:58

spectacular. Nathan, thank you so much for sharing your story and being part of our journey and leveraging the opportunity that was here to be able to flip the script and ask questions. That's awesome. We greatly appreciate you being here and taking the time and taking the risk to answer a LinkedIn request to have a conversation to lead to this. So thank you so much. All right. Have a great week.

Steve Doyle (: 25:59

awesome. Great.

Nathan Schnell (: 26:20

Absolutely. Thank you.

Steve Doyle (: 26:25

Yep.