Move to Profit with Stacia Hobson

Steven Doyle [: 00:00:00

Welcome to Blue Collar B's, a podcast that busts the popular myth that we can't find good people, highlighting how the different generations of today, the boomers, Gen X, millennials and Gen Z, are redefining work so that the industrial revolution that started in the US stays in the US. The Blue Collar B's podcast helps blue collar business owners like you build a business that'll thrive for decades to come by turning that blue collar B's into some blue collar business solutions.

Brad Herda [: 00:00:31

In this episode, you're going to learn the need for others to be involved is crucial to your long term success. The different generational needs as you make a move, hiring, interviewing tips as you go through mass hire and individual hires, and that the community you move in the culture matters.

Steven Doyle [: 00:00:49

Our guest today is Stacia Hobson, a dynamic and thoughtful Gen X leader who has learned not only about the impact of moving across town, but also across state lines. We hope you enjoy the show. Brad Hurda, my friend, how are you doing today?

Brad Herda [: 00:01:05

I am doing wonderful, Mister Stephen Doyle, as we start the brand new year of 2024. Off with weather that is not normal for this time of year in the upper midwest by any stretch of the imagination. But it's good to be back. It's good to be back in recording mode. And good to see you, my friend.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:22

Right, yes, it's great to see you today. You know, as I was reflecting on the. Oh, you know, well, I'm good at the B's part of this whole thing. You are, you know, so. So, Brad, let's, let's kind of mix it up a little. So, speaking of this great weather, when do you think it's going to snow? Even though.

Brad Herda [: 00:01:46

Soon. How soon? I don't know. I don't know. I've got a couple landscaping clients that are waiting for it to snow. Like it will get all the snow. We'll get it all together. You'll get all your plowing in at the end of the year, so.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:57

Right. You may be plowing till June, but it's overdeveloped.

Brad Herda [: 00:01:59

Okay, exactly.

Steven Doyle [: 00:02:01

So, Brad, who do we have on the show today?

Brad Herda [: 00:02:04

So, our guest today is Stacia Hobson. The co owner of Image industries incorporated began her career in the family business upon graduating from college. Although her plan was never to work for the business, let alone own it, she was key in transforming that business from 100% distribution to 100% manufacturing. Today, she runs operations for their multimillion dollar manufacturing business, serving nine distinct vertical markets. Learning to navigate the family politics. I can't wait to hear some of those stories. Provided a sturdy and durable foundation for future growth. She is acutely aware of what takes to succeed as a woman in a male dominated blue collar industry.

Brad Herda [: 00:02:44

Passionate and proud of being manufacturing and feels as backbone of the United States. So we have alignment there, which is good, which is why we want her on the show. And over three decades of experience under her belt, she has acquired extensive practical knowledge of business relationships and entrepreneurships. Recent current best selling authorization, her book move to profit, as she has moved her businesses three different times for various different reasons, and they're currently in Mississippi. Loves her dogs and her quarter horses. So, Stacia, welcome to blue collar B's. We are delighted to have you here today.

Speaker C [: 00:03:17

To be here.

Brad Herda [: 00:03:19

Excellent. She says that now we'll ask at the end of the show for customer satisfaction survey. How are your experience at the end of the show?

Speaker C [: 00:03:28

Yeah.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:30

Yep. So, Stacia, before I forget, and Brad reminds me that I forgot, which generation do you fit in with? Identify with.

Speaker C [: 00:03:40

I'm Gen X. Yeah.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:44

So all three of us, even though Brad's a boomer and I'm a millennial, all three of us are gen xs.

Brad Herda [: 00:03:50

Technically. Technically, that is a true statement.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:54

That is true. So, Stacia, we've talked a little bit on the pre show about the book move to profit. So as you've moved your business into stuff and then wrote your book, how has being a business owner or working in the business helped shape for that book, help shape the mindset for the book move to profit?

Speaker C [: 00:04:21

Well, the move from Illinois to Mississippi at the beginning part of the move, you're just not really thinking it's that serious when you're doing site selections and working on grants and that kind of thing. And it wasn't until we actually got here that I was faced with my biggest mindset, challenge of survival. Literally survival. And the first two years was really difficult. And that's why I wrote the book, was because there was nothing out there, any kind of information on how to move your company, that kind of move that, you know, I was $10 million company and was moving a 67,000 square foot facility 900 miles away and lost pretty much my entire workforce and thought that my current workforce would have. Now, there are people in there, don't get me wrong, that without them, we absolutely would have failed. But I thought that I had a better relationship, a better bond with my folks, that they would have come and helped train in Mississippi, you know, et cetera, et cetera. And they absolutely refused.

Speaker C [: 00:05:46

And, you know, I wasn't prepared for that. No, I didn't really. You know, I mean, that my workforce was extraordinarily stable. I had very good relations, and I couldn't get anybody to come down for a week. Now, with that being said, I had six people that did not move or maybe a little bit more that did not move with me, but that did come and did stay, you know, in a hotel or in the group home or whatever. Some stayed as long as six months, and, you know, and God bless them. So I wasn't counting on that, either. So I'm on the good side, right?

Brad Herda [: 00:06:27

Yeah, we got both ends of the equation, essentially.

Speaker C [: 00:06:29

Yeah. So it was. It was a. It was a real mental battle to stay in the game, and I was like, shoot, if I had known so much of this information for the move. Right. Like, I would have structured things differently, I would have figured things out differently. I can't say that I wouldn't have moved. And now, four years later, and with the overreaching laws of Illinois for policies and et cetera, et cetera, not getting any better, I am actually really glad that we moved.

Speaker C [: 00:07:04

And financially, it was a win, but it was, you know, it was.

Brad Herda [: 00:07:12

A long journey through the deep, dark tunnel to see the light at the end of it, right?

Speaker C [: 00:07:17

Yes, yes. When it started to look that the light at the end of the tunnel was not a freight train, those started to be some good days.

Brad Herda [: 00:07:28

So, as you made that move in transition, how did you celebrate the winds along the way? Right. It's a four year journey. How did you celebrate just those small little wins along the way with yourself or your team members? So, that way to maybe take away that. That burden of the tunnel is dark and deep.

Speaker C [: 00:07:49

Yeah. It was challenging. I can't say that I did that much. We would go out as a team for dinner and so on and so forth, for the people who actually moved with us from Illinois, as well as my, you know, my peeps who were not moving but who were there with us? We did a lot of dinners and things like that, but honest to God, we were all working 16 hours, days, and you're exhausted. And then, you know, and then the guys from Illinois wanted to go back and see their families. Right? So that's what they did.

Brad Herda [: 00:08:26

Okay. Would you. Would you have put some things along the way in that journey to have some of those intentional moments of, hey, we got this done today. Let's celebrate what we've accomplished versus looking at all the things that are ahead?

Speaker C [: 00:08:40

Well, and so, I guess, you know, our definitions might be a little bit different, you know? So, yes, we did come together on a regular basis to good job. Can you believe this got done? And another, you know, another milestone is working, right? Like things that you just, you know, so little moments in the day or at the end of the day or the beginning of the next day where like, gosh, I didn't think we're going to be able to climb that mountain, and here we are. Great job, right.

Steven Doyle [: 00:09:11

For all of us, for our business owners, as they potentially are looking at their business in different locations that they're in. So there's obviously things you've learned along the way that help shape that the book move to profit if they're in that same mode of, hey, I may need to pick up my business and move. What are some key points that you would like to point out to them that HeLp shape your book?

Speaker C [: 00:09:39

So I would hire a site selection consultant. Absolutely. 100%, hands down. Even if you're moving within your same state, just X miles away. They know. And the reason why I say this is that they are the ones who deal with grants and economic development organizations and workforce development investment boards and things like that. They know the communities, they can guide you as to labor. Is this community going to have a viable workforce? And is this not.

Speaker C [: 00:10:17

And so on and so forth. So that is one thing that I used the next move group, and they did so much of the work for me and opened up my eyes to different types of opportunities. Right. And it's all about what you need, want, have to have all of it combined, and then you need to make a decision and move forward. But I know a lot of people who have moved to, you know, small moves and, you know, and you don't necessarily need to recruit those. But there's grants out there that I didn't even know existed. So I was like, shoot. Because we were in Wooddale, Illinois, right outside of O'Hare airport, and moved to little town Huntley, which is not so little anymore.

Speaker C [: 00:11:11

But when we moved out there, gosh, we could have gotten grants to move out there. It was a little farming town, and I had no idea that I could have gotten financial aid for the actual move or for, you know, developing a workforce out there or whatever. So, you know, just stuff you don't know.

Steven Doyle [: 00:11:30

Right.

Brad Herda [: 00:11:30

So as you made that move, this last move was 900 miles, and you've had some of the shorter moves along the way. And even if we're moving from one block to the next block, there's that perception sometimes of, hey, we're not the same company anymore or people might look at it. Well, I like the old building better than the new. How did you keep the culture, your energy level within your staff members to continue to produce forward and move forward and keep quality, keep energized and stay focused on the end result of delivering for your customers at the end of the day?

Speaker C [: 00:12:05

Well, I think it has to do with the owner's mindset or the CEO's or whoever is leading that move. And I never once, you know, am I moved from Wooddale to Huntley or Bedford park to Wooddale. Never once thought that I would have to think about that, you know, think about the culture. I wasn't even, you know, going from Woodale to Holland, which was a distance. I was never even concerned that my workforce wouldn't come with me, which is really kind of egotistical, you know, looking at it that way. But I, and I, and I know it's, one of my friends just moved and she was really worried about it. I'm like, you're moving, you know, you're moving 8 miles. My goodness.

Speaker C [: 00:12:52

And people are going to be with you. They're not going to leave. At the end of the day, people want stability. At the end of the day, people do not like change. They don't, generally speaking, like risk. And moving, you know, changing jobs, moving to a different company takes, takes a lot of courage and, you know, so, and I didn't even look at it that way. I was just like, you know, we're only moving 20 miles. There are people there.

Speaker C [: 00:13:23

People are going to come with us. Especially initially, it was only 20 miles, 24 miles, whatever it was. But I'm like, at least, I got at least six months to manage, right, or to build up a new workforce if that's what I need to do. And, yeah, I mean, you know, over time, the people who were traveling greater distances, you know, left and whatever, but it was not all at once, you know, etcetera. So it was not a big, big hurdle in my mind. And I know it is in a lot of business owners minds. And then you get the questions from your employees. Well, you know, I have to drive farther.

Speaker C [: 00:14:02

Are you going to increase my payrol? Right. And those kinds of things, you know, it's taking me, you know, 15 minutes now instead of ten.

Brad Herda [: 00:14:11

Are you going to increase my, I got three stoplights to go through instead of one now.

Speaker C [: 00:14:18

You know, and that's, you know, and that's a concern, too. And I, I have always held my ground and my friends who have moved I've been like, just hold your ground and just be firm and consistent with everyone right now.

Steven Doyle [: 00:14:33

This is a. Since we do talk a lot about generations on the show, has your workforce changed generationally throughout the different moves? And if so, how have you had to adapt to the different generations?

Speaker C [: 00:14:50

So when we were in Illinois, my team members were, for the most part, older. And when I say older, I'm talking mid forties through mid sixties. And so obviously, you know, the people who are in the mid sixties are no longer with us, et cetera, et cetera. And we also had started to recruit some people in their early thirties. But really, I was not successful in recruiting 20 year olds. I wasn't looking at anyone in their twenties specifically. When someone comes for a job, I'm looking at skill set, can you fit in? Blah, blah, blah, what can we teach you? And so on and so forth. That was where I was in Illinois, but my staff in Illinois was predominantly getting older, which is a common problem when I moved to Mississippi.

Speaker C [: 00:15:59

Whole different story.

Brad Herda [: 00:16:03

You're not from there, just so you know.

Speaker C [: 00:16:09

And I'm grateful. I have a much younger staff. My average age is actually 40. And I have eleven people in their twenties. I've got 16 people in their thirties. I've got eleven people in their forties, six in their fifties, and five in their sixties. So I feel much more balanced.

Steven Doyle [: 00:16:35

Kudos to you.

Brad Herda [: 00:16:37

Celebrate that victory right there, Stacia. That is, that is a recipe for long term success because you are able to transfer that knowledge and that wisdom amongst all those different individuals and also captured in the different formats, because the 60 year old person's probably not going to go create the excel file, but the young 20 year old can go do that and teach them and vice versa, and they're learning from each other. And congratulations. That's spectacular.

Steven Doyle [: 00:17:09

That's awesome.

Speaker C [: 00:17:10

Yeah. So it's a very balanced workforce. And the thing that I find, so, I don't know, I just find it amusing is that if we're under 45, let's just use that as a very generic number. I'm not saying everybody at 46 does not do this. 46 or older. Right.

Steven Doyle [: 00:17:36

I'll let you know. I'll let you know.

Speaker C [: 00:17:40

Recruiting, I get the applications, right? And I'm like, okay. I feel like this person would be a good fit. So I will text the person to come in for a job interview, because if they are, generally speaking, 45 or younger, they'll respond to the text, they will not answer the phone. And if they are over, say, 45 ish, they will call me. They will get the text. They won't respond by the text, but they will call me. And I just chuckle to myself and I'm right every single time, man.

Brad Herda [: 00:18:28

That is a. I would have thought the number would be a little bit lower on the tech side, but I could see that age being about right because that's that crossover area of.

Speaker C [: 00:18:40

Yeah, I mean, not everybody in their forties texts, but a lot of them do. So it's, you know, I just have come up with, generally speaking, she just.

Steven Doyle [: 00:18:51

Called me a millennial, Brett.

Brad Herda [: 00:18:53

I've been, I've been saying that for years, Steve.

Steven Doyle [: 00:18:57

Because texting is the number one way to get ahold of me. I'll pick up the phone. If I've got your number in there, I'll pick up the phone. But if I don't, I ain't picking up the phone.

Speaker C [: 00:19:08

Yep.

Brad Herda [: 00:19:08

He doesn't even pick up my phone.

Steven Doyle [: 00:19:10

Call half the time I don't send a voicemail.

Speaker C [: 00:19:14

And down here especially more so, I think it's true everywhere but here, if you don't have a 662 area code, you're never going to get that phone answered.

Steven Doyle [: 00:19:31

Really?

Speaker C [: 00:19:32

Yeah. Wow, interesting. But they will respond to your text. So. But I have to be very specific in my text as to, you know, who I am, where I'm located, you know, very specifically. Yeah, very, very specifically because a lot of people don't, even though it's a small town, don't even know that, you know, image industries. Is there a.

Brad Herda [: 00:19:57

So for some of our audience right there in the ideal category upon what you just described from the text bracketing standpoint of things, our audiences generally in that millennial audience, because that's where the podcast world has started from and lived. And many of them, they're at that growth point. And you kind of talked about using the site selection type organizations to support their opportunity to move or relocate. Are there any other, hey, you should really pay attention to these things. You kind of mentioned the opportunity for grants, talked a little bit about the workforce, and not that everybody's going to move with you for 20 miles, but is there anything else that's hanging out there that should be the don't let this happen to you? Words of advice?

Speaker C [: 00:20:45

Yes. So if you're doing well, any kind of move, you need to evaluate your community and what is the culture of that community. So. And can you vibe with that culture like, you know, and I know that sounds kind of crazy because you should be just like, this is the culture of the business and blah, blah, blah. But I got so much pushback from my early team members that really felt that I, you know, could not adapt. And I was like, well, that's really interesting. So that's one thing that you need to get into the culture and get known before you even move. And what, however that media is, if it's Facebook, if it's the newspaper, if it's doing charity work, whatever, you need to get into that, into the community so that they, and especially if you're going to a small community so that people start to know who you are, because know, like and trust, if people don't know you like you and trust you, they are not going to work for you.

Brad Herda [: 00:21:59

Correct.

Speaker C [: 00:22:00

And if they do work for you, it's going, it's not going to be a full engagement.

Steven Doyle [: 00:22:06

Right.

Brad Herda [: 00:22:06

Right.

Speaker C [: 00:22:08

And the other thing, if you're looking for workforce training investments, where is the workforce training? Where do they stand, the workforce boards? So are they engaged? Are they able to. So, like, the colleges, the workforce development colleges, can they support your needs? What are your needs? Like, you need to be really specific, right?

Brad Herda [: 00:22:36

Yes. When we went through our growth phase at Busiris back in the day and we built our factory and we're trying to get, you know, we need to hire 200 welders, you know, to come out and support, you had to go through about 200 to get the right quantity that you needed to fill the workforce because we had a large fallout rate. It was ridiculous. And the area technical colleges weren't able to keep up. And so we ended up having to put together our own schooling program to do our own training activity, which was a huge undertaking, and distraction and all those other things that would have been great not to. But at the end, you had to in order to support the end goal.

Speaker C [: 00:23:14

Yeah. And that's a great point. The fallout, my 1st 18 months, I probably churned 150 or so people. That's a lot of people. And at that time, my workforce was, you know, just 50 people. So basically, I turned my entire workforce three x full time.

Brad Herda [: 00:23:35

You want to do that with inventory, not people.

Speaker C [: 00:23:38

Right, exactly.

Brad Herda [: 00:23:41

Wow. Yeah. Wow.

Speaker C [: 00:23:44

It was brutal. And which is, you know, I mean, there's a whole thing in my book about how to interview folks and, you know, and so on and so forth and the workforce investment boards and so on, workforce development, they were really great. And they are very logical, but that's not necessarily how people are.

Steven Doyle [: 00:24:05

Right.

Speaker C [: 00:24:07

What a very logical plan that they laid out for me. And I bought into it, you know, hook, line and sink. I was like, yeah, I mean, it all makes sense. It was not good because that is just not how people function. Right. Again, it's the whole know like and trust. And you have to develop that kind of first versus that mass hiring that we did. So I would, I would caution on, you have to do the mass hire, but I would caution about the approach to take to do that mass hiring.

Steven Doyle [: 00:24:45

Right.

Brad Herda [: 00:24:46

So what would be in the interviewing process? Maybe post mass hiring when you started getting into more of those onesie twosie type scenarios, what would be the, what's your interviewing? You know, Golden Nugget, what is your, hey, this worked for me most of the time to find the right person the first time versus the second, 3rd or fourth time.

Speaker C [: 00:25:08

Well, two things. One is I changed my application to, yes, it still has on there. You know, do you have a high school diploma? Blah blah blah, ged, blah blah blah. But I changed it to read. What are your hobbies? What are your outside interests? You know, what do you do outside of work? And that is very telling in people's thoughts and skill sets on what you can tap into. And it's very telling as to where their priorities are. So if you have someone, and I'm not saying that this is a bad thing, but if you have someone that says my priority is my baby, well, that's not a bad thing, right. Because you need to take care of your offspring.

Speaker C [: 00:25:56

But also know that if the child has a problem, the parent is going to go.

Steven Doyle [: 00:26:03

Right.

Speaker C [: 00:26:03

And again, not a bad thing. Just to be prepared, right. Because certainly I want people to be able to provide for their families. Right. You just need to be prepared on that. And then the other thing, not to get like woo woo on you, but I, like, I feel, I feel the application, like I see the person and I make as bad as this is like an immediate judgment. How are they coming across? Are they well spoken and things like that and where not so much their job history because that's a tough thing to go by these days, right? Very much right. Although I can, you know, identify which folks are working the system and, you know, and those types of things, those are indicators on, on that application.

Speaker C [: 00:26:57

But just because a person's been out of a job for a bit does not mean that they're unemployable. And just because a person churns jobs every one or two years does not mean that they're unemployable either.

Steven Doyle [: 00:27:11

Right.

Speaker C [: 00:27:12

So it's one of those things I feel that you would be really good in my CNC department.

Brad Herda [: 00:27:20

Right. And that's that's very interesting that you say that, because I've got a client that we were just doing some hiring with, and he's like, hey, I've got these three applications. I looked them up on LinkedIn, looked at different things. I knew what their culture was like. I knew what was going on. I knew some of the organizations that they had, people had worked for in the past, and I'm like, interview them. But here's the things I would question and they go through. Do the interview.

Brad Herda [: 00:27:41

Go. How'd you know that? How'd you figure that out? Well, again, it's about paying attention to those things, knowing the cultures of different activities and paying attention to, you know, the visualization of what those things are. And is it going to be a fit or not a fit? And that can take out a lot of, a lot of noise and energy right away versus, oh, hey, they've got the right skill set, but they're not good people. They're not. It's hire first, hire for fit. Teach them to do the thing.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:10

Right.

Speaker C [: 00:28:11

Exactly. Exactly. And I walk. Well, I don't, but I have my team members walk. Anyone who's looking for a job through the plan, this is ensure them the exact job. And if they want to sit down and try it, we do that. Right. Like, as much as you as they want to or that we can absolutely do.

Speaker C [: 00:28:35

I think that helps tremendously when, you know, by determining. Right. You can see someone's horror when.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:45

You want me to do what.

Speaker C [: 00:28:47

Right. My hands are going to get dirty.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:52

Right, right.

Speaker C [: 00:28:54

These are fasteners. We're working in oil.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:57

Right, right, right.

Speaker C [: 00:28:59

That's not everybody's bag. I get it. Right?

Steven Doyle [: 00:29:02

Yeah.

Brad Herda [: 00:29:02

Your pants are going to get dirty.

Steven Doyle [: 00:29:05

Yeah. And your car is going to get dirty when you get in there with those same pants.

Brad Herda [: 00:29:09

So the locker room is over there. If you have a problem with the locker room, that's a whole other topic.

Steven Doyle [: 00:29:19

Awesome. Stacia, I have another question for you, and I always like to ask this for very, you know, the seasoned professionals. Obviously, you've had moved a couple of the business a couple times. So knowing that you've moved it a couple times, what is one thing you would tell yourself in the past? So your future self, giving your past self some advice. What is like one golden nugget that you would tell yourself that you won't mind sharing with our listeners that you wish you would have known?

Speaker C [: 00:29:51

There's so much that I wish. I. No, I think my biggest pain was moving the inventory and my finished goods and I took, prior to the move, I took special care to get all my racks labeled and get all my inventory. I did a full count of inventory. Not, you know, not in one week. We didn't do any shutdown. It was, you know, five parts a day or whatever, right. And got that into our ERP system.

Speaker C [: 00:30:27

We even labeled the boxes for the inventory of where it went on the racks. And my failure was that I did not communicate clearly enough that the racks are coming. They are labeled. The parts are labeled. It doesn't matter where, how the racks get thrown up. Just make sure that the parts are on the parts where the box is marked and going. Right. That.

Brad Herda [: 00:30:59

Yes, yes.

Speaker C [: 00:31:01

Right?

Steven Doyle [: 00:31:02

Yes.

Speaker C [: 00:31:03

All that matters.

Brad Herda [: 00:31:04

We want a's and a's and b's and b's and c's and C's. Just.

Speaker C [: 00:31:07

Exactly. And I did not. I was at the back end of the movie, not at the front end. And so I was back in Illinois and sending. And my staff was getting smaller and smaller, and I was just sending stuff down. And the receiving end, my. I had a new shipping and receiving guy, so he didn't know, but then he enlisted help of other Illinois employees, and they just threw the racks up and threw parts on any old rack. And so we couldn't find anything, like, literally anything.

Speaker C [: 00:31:52

And it was. It was painful. And had. Had I been me, the, you know, gone through the process, me telling the old me, I would have said, stacia, when that inventory moves, you need to fly to Memphis and get to the plant to meet and greet it.

Brad Herda [: 00:32:14

And show them what to do with it. Yeah.

Steven Doyle [: 00:32:20

Excellent. Excellent. Well, thank you for sharing some of your wisdom and your insights today.

Brad Herda [: 00:32:26

How do people get the book? Where do they get it? How do they connect with you if they want to learn more after they read the book and or understand how to leverage the services that image provides for the industry.

Speaker C [: 00:32:38

So the book is on Amazon, and at the end of the book, I believe, or maybe at the end of the book, there's a QR code that goes to my website. So at the very back, little QR code, and that will take you to my website. And you can email me directly there, or you can reach me still at image Industries, staciahobsonmichindustries.com. and our webpage is obviously www.imageindustries.com.

Brad Herda [: 00:33:13

Cool. Congratulations on your move. Congratulations. Congratulations on creating a workforce that is built for sustainability. We can't stress that enough how to our audience and even to yourself, how important that is to be able to build an organization where anybody of any age can come work in it and be successful. And you've done that. So congratulations. That is a big deal.

Brad Herda [: 00:33:38

And I am just looking forward to hearing more of your continued success as we continue to stay connected on LinkedIn, etcetera. So thank you so much, Stacia, for taking time on your day.

Speaker C [: 00:33:47

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you.

Brad Herda [: 00:33:49

All right. Thank you very much. Bye. Thank you for listening to blue Collar B's, brought to you by vision for business solutions and professional business Coaching, Inc. If you'd like to learn more on today's topic, just reach out to Steve Doyle or myself, Brad Hurda. Please, like share rate and review this show as feedback is the only way we can get better. Let's keep blue collar businesses strong for generations to come.