Would You Do Your Own Root Canal with Elisa Ruer

Steven Doyle [: 00:00:00

Welcome to Blue Collar B's, a podcast that busts the popular myth that we can't find good people, highlighting how the different generations of today, the boomers, Gen X, millennials and Gen Z, are redefining work so that the industrial revolution that started in the US stays in the US. The Blue Collar B's podcast helps blue collar business owners like you build a business that'll thrive for decades to come by turning that blue collar B's into some blue collar business solutions.

Brad Herda [: 00:00:32

In this episode, you're going to learn the importance of filing your Fincen. If you haven't done it already, why doing your own root canal is a really bad idea. Generational ownership perspectives and generational legacy. The business or the cash?

Steven Doyle [: 00:00:46

Our guest today is Elisa Ruhr, a Gen X attorney who will change how you think about lawyers. Elisa shares her perspective on why experts are an important part of every business. We hope you enjoy the show. Welcome back, Brad, to blue collar B's. How you doing today?

Brad Herda [: 00:01:04

I am fantastic, Mister Doyle, as you are in the motor city of Detroit, as we are sitting here on this Friday in January, I'm sure that if there's a victory on Sunday, you probably need a fire extinguisher.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:18

There's probably going to be a lot of couches burned in somewhere.

Brad Herda [: 00:01:22

So prepare appropriately if there's a victory on Sunday in San Francisco.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:27

I just want to know, Brad, at your house, do all your neighbors know what such a Lions fan you really are? Like, does your house exude lionism? That's what I want to know.

Brad Herda [: 00:01:39

No, it does not. It does not. Really. It's.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:42

I mean, you're the fan in this.

Brad Herda [: 00:01:43

No one cares here. They care if you're a Bears fan or a Vikings fan, then you get hated. No one cares that I'm a Lions fan. No one cares because it's like kitty cat meow. No big deal.

Steven Doyle [: 00:01:57

Because you're such a boomer. I mean, you've been the fan for what?

Brad Herda [: 00:02:00

Wow.

Steven Doyle [: 00:02:00

Wow, 500 years or so, something like that. Since the last one.

Brad Herda [: 00:02:04

Yeah, I do. I do remember Billy Sims. So in case you. I can go back that far.

Steven Doyle [: 00:02:09

Who's that?

Brad Herda [: 00:02:10

Yeah. Okay, that's, that's my point, you jackass.

Steven Doyle [: 00:02:17

Let's get, let's get going here.

Brad Herda [: 00:02:20

All right.

Steven Doyle [: 00:02:20

Yeah. Who do we got on the show today, bro?

Brad Herda [: 00:02:22

Our guest today is Elisa Haruhar. She is a lawyer here in the Milwaukee area. She's been practicing for 26 years. Six years as corporate counsel for title company, five years of mortgage company, then out on her own, specializing in corporate law. And when she said, why do you want me on? I'm like, because you have some great insights to help our various demographics of our audiences. And you. And she works with all demographics. So let's see what they're thinking when it comes to legal concerns.

Brad Herda [: 00:02:51

Because at the end of the day, every one of our audience listeners, if you own your own business, you need counsel. And you better find one. Cause there's. You're better to pay them now than to pay them later. So welcome to the show, Lisa. How are you today?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:03:05

Thank you for having me.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:06

Awesome. So, Alisa, before I forget, which generation do you best fit in with? Identify with?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:03:15

I am generation X. I was born in 1965.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:19

Oh, wow. So, right. I mean, Brad is. I mean, I'm saying that. Oh, wow. Because you're Brad. No, because you see, Brad is like in the fifties. I'm in the seventies.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:32

I mean, you're right in the middle. It's great.

Brad Herda [: 00:03:34

Whatever.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:35

Steve, you said Brad loves it when I do this to him.

Brad Herda [: 00:03:38

Oh, wow. To our guests. That's not a way to welcome our guests, Steve.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:42

See, I just love the fact that she's like right in between. Because you're in the fifties, right?

Brad Herda [: 00:03:46

Sure, whatever. You're gonna be that guy today, aren't you?

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:49

I am that guy today.

Brad Herda [: 00:03:50

Okay, perfect. How about you ask a question, Steve? Let's start there.

Steven Doyle [: 00:03:54

So how did you get started in wanting to get into law and more on the side of business law?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:04:01

I was in my thirties when I went to law school. Prior to that, I had worked on fast food for a long time. Then I went to. I always worked and went to school.

Brad Herda [: 00:04:11

That's where the Panda Express comes from. I got it now.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:04:14

I got it started. Orange Julian. So basically, I think the biggest impact was I always liked reading and I liked learning things. And then I started working at the old Alice Chalmers, which was Siemens Power Corp. When I was there in the labor department and I worked with the union, I handled all the grievances. And I just liked that atmosphere. I liked the corporate atmosphere and I liked reading contracts. And that's what when I was.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:04:43

When you do grievances for unions, all you do is your contracts all day. That was what I did. And then they sent in. We were negotiating a contract and they brought in the lawyers. And I'm like, I think I want to be a lawyer so I can do this. So that's how I ended up going to law school.

Brad Herda [: 00:05:01

Cool. And then. So today, today's practice, you're doing mostly what? And working with whom mostly I work.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:05:08

With people that are buying or selling a business or starting a business. So we're structuring how they're going to be set up at LLC, a corporation. I have a lot of people that, they've owned businesses for years and they realize they need an attorney. Now, I review a lot of contracts for people. A lot of people come to me after they've gotten in trouble, and then we have to work backwards to get them in order. So, and I have a diverse group of people. Mostly I have baby boomers and generation x people. The millennials are not coming as much.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:05:40

And I actually talked to one of my CPA friends this morning about this because they're all diY. So they're all doing templates off of the Internet. They're doing searches. So mostly I have people that are, again, it's the baby boomers and the generation eggs.

Brad Herda [: 00:05:54

Okay. So you talked about helping organizations, you know, figure out what path forward from those things. So the new laws coming in for declaring, you know, who you are, what business you're doing, and all those other things, the new financial reporting records for new businesses starting and for existing businesses. What do you have to say to those younger kids? Right. All these young kids that are going out and starting their opportunity to go get this money and we're going to do this and we're going to just go and have it go through our, we'll just, just pay John, and John will take care of it as just cash income or we'll get a check to John. What's in store if they fail to realize that they actually have a business, not just a transaction, when they, that business owner comes to ask them for their 1099 so that they can go and pay them at the end of the year, next year when it happens. So what do you, what's, what advice do you get to those Gen Z ers that are out gigging it?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:06:51

I guess the problem is that it will cost you less to get set up correctly than it will to not spend that money when people come at you because the last thing you want, it isn't the IR's you're worried about, it's the department, especially in Wisconsin, Department of Revenue. They will knock on your door and it's not a joke. So I always tell people, I understand that everyone thinks attorneys are expensive and we're not all that expensive, but that at the end of the day, if you don't have everything in order, it's going to cost you more money later on, especially now with FinCEn which you mentioned before, Brad, we talked about it. That's serious. That's the federal government. It's one thing to set up. People go online. We all know we can set that up in three minutes.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:07:35

You can set up an LLC corporation. It's. The other two parts are at the EIN number. Everyone knows how to get that. It's that you need an operating agreement or a shareholders agreement. That's key, especially money. And then second is with that Fincen, which just kicked in January 1. That's not a joke.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:07:53

You have got to register. If you're setting up a new LLC or corporation, you have to do it within the 90 days. If you set up something prior to January 1 of this year, you have until the end of December of this year to do that. But it's not a joke anymore. It's serious. The penalties are huge.

Brad Herda [: 00:08:11

They're massive.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:08:12

You don't want to mess that up. And it will cost you far more money to have my firm partner is a litigator. To have us defend you. That's where we make our money. I don't bring in any money. It's when you mess up and you come to me too late. Money. Maya, right? Yeah.

Brad Herda [: 00:08:28

So you mentioned operating agreement and documents of incorporation, all those fun things. And how when you are working with your business owners, because I know you work with a lot of tradesmen as well. H vac contractors, manufacturing owners, and things like that, when they're out there trying to transfer those relationships to their kids, or they've got a young individual that might be starting up, and they bring you their www.ididitmyself.com documents. What's some of the things that. How open are they to your suggestions and ideas? Or what's that interaction looking like today as you go across the generations?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:09:07

It depends. I had one last week where he owns with his father, and the father's had the business for since 19. Well, actually goes a grandfather, 1946. And my client, he's been filing with his CPA and everything. He owns 50% interest, but they don't have anything showing that because it's family. And so he just went to buy a $2 million building, and he's trying to get a loan, and they've got nothing showing that over the years. He's taken this. So he was very receptive.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:09:37

He's great because he wants the building and the lender needed it. So I said, we can work backwards. You know, we can draft an agreement, that document that says, we're missing this, we're missing this, but this is what it is and everybody signs it. Where it gets messy is two parts. One is when you're going to sell it to a third party that's unrelated and their attorney. When I'm on the buyer side, I want to make sure there's nobody out on the street that thinks they have an interest or does have an interest and we're unaware of it, or you get in a fight with your partner. Come on. Both love each other.

Brad Herda [: 00:10:13

Come on.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:10:16

You love each other today, but you're better off spending a couple hours with me and let's talk about all the nastiness and the ugliness. Get it on paper so that when it's time to leave each other, you've got it written down and there's no fighting.

Brad Herda [: 00:10:29

Audience members notice how she said when, not if, always when the partnership. So one of the things that we learned, Steve and I, as we're going through some activities and some training, always know how to get out before you get in.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:10:45

That's brilliant. Exactly.

Brad Herda [: 00:10:46

Yep.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:10:47

You have to know that there's an endgame and it's easier to do it now when you're both getting along and you're starting off, then later on when things are not going well and that's where the money comes in. That's where if, you know, if you've got a company that's worth a couple hundred thousand dollars and you're fighting, it's going to cost you that much to fight. You're better off just shutting it down. And it's sad to watch people do that. So you're much better off paying us a little bit of money now to make sure that you've got that relationship tied up right.

Brad Herda [: 00:11:17

And how are you seeing the transition of family businesses today and their willingness to let the son or daughter or grandson or granddaughter or whomever take control versus being told what to do in that whole process and different things. What do you see as you have multiple generations at the table in typically, very, one side might be very euphoric, the other side might be very tense because it's their identity.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:11:49

That's an interesting point. It's, I find that with my baby boomers, those people have worked hard their whole life to build up their business, and they are the, I'm going to say the fathers or the parents are honored to be able to transfer to their children. Their children have been working in the business and the parents are happy to transfer it over. It's exactly what they plan to happen. Sometimes you got to remind them that they're transferring over and they're not going to have as much control. But it's a different mindset. They've killed themselves basically to be able to have an asset to transfer. Generation X is interesting because those parents, the people, and I say that we have started these, their kids are not interested and they know it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:12:35

And so they come to me like here's the deal. I have seven sons. I had one a couple weeks ago, seven sons and nobody wants my Vac company. I have a lot of those and nobody wants it. They're all doing different things. And he's got two sons that do, do HBC work but they're working for a huge company. They don't want to do, they don't want to be up restless nights. They don't want to worry about money.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:12:57

They don't want to do it. They want to be able to go on vacation and not worry. And my Gen X parents, I'm going to say it that way so that no one accused me of being sexist. But the fathers, the fathers, sorry, the fathers, yeah, the truth hurts. The truth does hurt. The fathers understand that and theyre okay with it. They say, listen, I get it. My kids want to have a different life than I did and I understand it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:13:23

So lets just sell it. Lets sell it. And then their attitude is really, its refreshing because then we find a buyer, right, we get all that done and they amass some wealth, they have some money but they know thats going to end up as a legacy to the children for the money. So they look at it different and then it's not such a negative experience. My seven sons, one, I thought he was going to be very, very distressed. He's trying to get his, the two sons to take over it and they're dad, we don't want it. We don't want it. But it's all right and the father's all right with it.

Brad Herda [: 00:13:54

Did you gain any insight as to maybe why they didn't want to get involved at all in your conversations?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:14:01

It was amazing. They both said they watched him not be able to go on vacation, not be able to do anything. Somebody would quit. He'd be out at four in the morning taking care of things that somebody else was supposed to do, to worry when somebody got sick. He had to worry. He had a couple people that have gotten hurt over the years. He felt terrible when people go on work cop. He didn't care about the money.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:14:23

He worried about these people. They had families and they got hurt on the job and he felt that they had watched all of that. They had watched him come home. They had watched it when he was worried about money. They didn't want to do that. They wanted to just go in, punch in, do a good job, and then punch out at the end of the day and not worry about it. And he, it was interesting with him because he, he was fine with it. He said, I want them to have a better life than I did.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:14:52

I want them to have a better sense of just a piece, I guess, was what, at the end of the day was what he said, okay, that's interesting.

Brad Herda [: 00:15:01

That's interesting that the observation is there. And we see that quite often, that whole we don't want to do what dad did type scenario. And the hard part is to eventually have them understand it doesn't have to be the way dad did it. They can do it differently. They could do it differently. They could make a difference in a different way and run it differently. Dad may not like it, but you could do it differently.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:15:26

And that's, it's, every once in a while, we'll bring that up to people when they're talking about, you know, one of the children wants it and the others don't. And then there's a fight about that. How is that gonna take on? We still wanna have an ownership interest, but we don't wanna be there every day. And the parents do get involved in that. And it's interesting to watch different children, types of children. Some of them listen to the parents, right? They go ahead and listen and they're gonna work it out. This one with the H Vac company, it's interesting. They just don't want it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:15:56

They just don't want it. And. But you're right, they definitely. There's other ways to work. Not everybody has to work. I mean, in the legal profession, it has completely changed. Brad and I. Brad's my business coach.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:16:08

Full disclosure. You talked about I have to change who I am.

Brad Herda [: 00:16:14

No, adapt. Not change, adapt.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:16:17

Okay? I adapt to what type of people and how they work. You know, when we went to school and we worked, it's 24/7 whatever. It's not that way anymore. So it's no different in our profession than it is in any other. Right.

Steven Doyle [: 00:16:30

So one of the things I want to kind of circle back to because it kind of caught me off guard a little bit, as you mentioned it. So if it caught me off guard, I'm pretty sure it's going to catch a lot of our trade owners off guard if they're not necessarily familiar with it because they're so busy doing the thing. When you talked about having an go back to the new laws, that changed that. So there's those that when you set up this year, there's a lot of stuff you have to do. But then you made a comment, oh, if you've previously set one up, you get a leeway. So if you don't mind, can you help break that down of, for those that with established businesses, what is the requirement that they need to be aware of and kind of like, what are the, at a high level, like, what are the steps that they need to do? And obviously, we would encourage them to turn to somebody like you for that help.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:17:24

So, and I will, I'm going to preface with most of your, anyone who owns a business that works with the CPA, they've been sending letters out. What you have to do is if you set up a corporation, even a nonprofit or an LLC, prior to January 1 of 2024, you have until December 31 to file an online report, as it's called the Beneficial Ownership Interest act. And you have to file a report online with FinCEN. Basically, you're going to outline who you are, who actually owns, because a lot of times everybody knows this. We layer things, right? We, I'm not buying that building. My LLC is. And then sometimes my corporation is the member of the LLC.

Steven Doyle [: 00:18:14

Right.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:18:14

That's all you can do that. Right. We can still structure this from here to the moon with eight. But the beneficial ownership interest that you're filing with FinCEn is going to have your name in it. You also have to upload a passport or a valid driver's license, and you have to give a lot of information, and you got to do that by the end of the year. So I would say in the first three weeks, we did not send out letters. I talked to my clients all the time. Yeah, my clients even, I'm going to say they all, a lot of people know about it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:18:49

And every time I talk to somebody I've worked with, I remind them, and we are going to send out a letter in March, but they, they're aware of it. And what I said is we're holding off until about, we're going to start in March, maybe April or May, and see what happens. There's been some little glitches. Not until the end of the year. There's no need for us to have to rush into it.

Steven Doyle [: 00:19:08

Right.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:19:08

But it's a lot of very important information, and you got to give it up. And if you don't, it's not as if you can say, I am not going to upload my driver's license, or the driver's license doesn't really match. I've got a problem because everything else is filed with your address. You're going to get yourself in trouble. If the lawyer that we are, we're going to have you signed an affidavit that says that we're upload, we're loading up what you're giving us, and you're telling us the truth. You're going to have to give up who you are, and there's no more hiding behind it. And that's what's going to happen. So if you're someone who set up an LLC before you can, and I tell your accountant, call your CPA, if you've got attorney, call your attorney, and they'll be able to help you to file that.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:19:55

I have a couple clients who called me. They did it on their own a couple weeks ago when it first started. And it's fine. You just have to, you have to make sure that you're not. And I'm smiling because you cannot lie. Don't misrepresent, because they're gonna make a point of some people and they're gonna start auditing, and it's not worth it. It's just not worth it.

Steven Doyle [: 00:20:14

Right.

Brad Herda [: 00:20:15

Well, I think we can put the Fincen, dot gov Boi link into our show notes for those that might be listening at that point in time, as well as a friendly reminder.

Steven Doyle [: 00:20:26

Yeah, yeah.

Brad Herda [: 00:20:27

Big deal. It's a big deal because that business owner's had his business for 35 years. What's this new thing? Well, I'm not, I'm not doing that. I'm not doing that. No, no, no, no. I don't care if you've owned it 35 years or three years, go do the thing, because it's going to be imperative. So, on that, I don't necessarily want to go all the way down that path, but do you think that at some point that the FinCEN documentation will be tied to those, Einstein, as to whether or not a transaction can occur through SBA lending and things like that?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:21:03

Very good.

Steven Doyle [: 00:21:06

Somebody's studying.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:21:07

Yeah, he is. Okay. I do. I think that. Not right now, but I think at some point, because you do get a filer number after you file it, I think that sbAs, and you know how they, everybody knows this. When you're going for SBA and some conventional, the bank wants the articles of incorporation or organization, shareholders bylaws, or the operating agreement in your eIn, which is the ss four, and they're now going to ask for the FinCen evidence. They're not going to touch it if they don't have it. And I think also that's going to be a good protection for a lot of people that if they didn't think about it, and now they're refinancing or they're trying to get some more money, or they're trying to sell their business, they're going to have to go in and register that.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:21:47

And then the question is, what are the fines and penalties going to be a lot three years later? Yes. And have you then red flagged yourself? So that's. It's kind of the same thing. Not to go off course, but with the Eidl loan, when everybody was taking those out, no one really thought too much. Like, it's a lot of money, it's for 30 years. It's at this rate. This is great. Well, now all these people, as I turn and look at 15 files, are trying to sell their business.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:22:14

And if you owe more than, like, 25,000 at idle, you can't just sell that business stock or asset. You need to get approval from the SBA. I feel like this is the same thing where people are going to get caught at some point, they're going to have to figure it out.

Brad Herda [: 00:22:29

So anybody that's over 42 years old, listening to the show and have that business, be aware. You've been warned. And the younger folks that are self serve, you should have already known this. And if you haven't, go figure it out. Do not listen to grandpa or grandma or daddy. Oh, yeah. Just do that LLC online for $135 and not do this, because it's going to be a problem. Alisa.

Brad Herda [: 00:22:55

What? So everybody's kind of afraid to talk to a lawyer in many cases. And like you said, you have this generational gap of differences to the acceptance of information because everybody's got their phone. So why should I pay the legal counsel when I can just do my Google search and use google law.com to be my. To be my counsel? What pieces of advice would you give to those Gen Zs, those millennials, the gen Xers and the boomers that are afraid to pay for expertise?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:23:29

Well, it's the. I mean, you have to have a CPA, right? I always tell people, you can have an accountant.

Steven Doyle [: 00:23:35

Do you?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:23:36

You gotta have an accountant for a certain point. And then at certain. When you start making nothing against accountants, we use one at a certain point, you need a CPA in there because of tax. There's things that you can. I'm not a CPA. I do a ton of research on certain things. I'm not at that level. So I need to get the expertise from someone else.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:23:56

So I always use the example you. And this is not to say that we're equal to anyone, but, you know, I don't want to have to have a new root canal. Right. It's too expensive. You got, I can google how to do a root canal. Believe it or not, I'm not going to do it. So you should not be drafting your own.

Steven Doyle [: 00:24:15

Do your own root canal. All right.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:24:17

You can google it how to do it. But do you do it? You don't.

Steven Doyle [: 00:24:23

It's a great analogy. I love it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:24:25

Okay. But it's.

Brad Herda [: 00:24:26

Absolutely love it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:24:27

But it's the same ideas that. It's something that you can google it. Trust.

Brad Herda [: 00:24:32

There's a business idea. That's a great idea. You want to be a partner on that business? Do it yourself root canal. Here's the kit.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:24:39

But it isn't going to turn out well usually. So it's expensive. Nobody wants to spend that kind of money. It's a good example.

Brad Herda [: 00:24:47

It's a great example.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:24:49

There's other reasons I think that people don't like to talk to attorneys. Not all attorneys charge you for every minute that they're on the phone. And a lot of times we really are trying to help you. I've had. I had somebody, Brad knows the story where I had a young lady come to me, spent 4 hours with her. She needed a waiver because she was doing some cool sculpting with a non cool sculpting doc with a non cool sculpting machine. She was less expensive. And I said, all right, I'll charge you 450.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:25:16

I'll change the waiver. You need a different waiver. She pulled one offline. I said, it's not. You need a few more things. I drafted it, thinking she'd pay 450 for it, and she didn't. And three years later, she came back to me and she burned somewhat. And so it had to go to my firm partner.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:25:32

She also hadn't listened to me about getting insurance. We're not going to talk. Had to go to my firm partner next door and ended up costing her. She was sued, $950,000. She had to file bankruptcy, and they lost their house, which is unusual. More to this, but she burned a 24 year old female all across the stomach. So now that 29 year old, that female now has permanent damage. And all because she wanted to say $450 and we've talked about it.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:26:02

We've talked about it. And I always took it personally. Like, why did you not listen to me? What about me? And she said, I just didn't think I needed it, and I feel like I made a mistake on it. But she said, I talked to my firm partner after everything was over. Right. I was involved, but I stayed. I said, would she have been sued? He said, she would have been sued. They sue everyone.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:26:25

But you had the language and the one that you drafted that would have saved her. So I was kind of telling you personally, if you're not going to listen to me, because I'm like, why would you not listen to me? So I think that it's worth it. Especially, there's a lot of contracts. I've got a lot of people that they do work for other people, and the contract doesn't have certain provisions. They'll pick and choose. Online is great. We all go online. I go online to get language sometimes from different at, and t has the best, best contract, 90 page contract you're ever going to see.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:26:56

You can steal from there for certain things, but at the end of the day, you can't cut and paste. If you don't know what you're cutting and pasting, then your provisions conflict with each other. Or I get a lot of people that are buying a franchise and they decide they don't want to pay me to review anything or draft anything, and that's fine. That's fine. So then they come back to me a year or two later with an issue, and I realize, I say, send me the shareholders agreement or the operating agreement, and it's got their names, but nobody signed it. And there's no provisions filled in, or it's from a different state. And I'm like, really? I'm not that expensive. Like, it would have saved you all these problems and all these issues.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:27:35

So I don't know if people are afraid or they just, nobody listen. You don't want to spend money on our canal. You don't want to spend money taking your car in for certain things. It's just certain things you have to do, right.

Brad Herda [: 00:27:47

It's the cost of being a business owner at the end of the day, in order to protect the risk. And, you know, your example of the, of the person that ended up losing their house, it's, they, they didn't think the risk was worth it to spend the $450 until it was. So that's a great example for people to understand. So. So, Lisa, how do people find your great content and wit and wisdom out in the world. Where do they find you? How do they get ahold of you if they want to talk to you more about different things.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:28:21

I'm on LinkedIn has all my contact information and then our website is www. Dot practice praktesslaw.com I picked my battles with my front partner. I should have picked the battle on the name. I didn't at the time, but that's what the name it.

Brad Herda [: 00:28:39

Yeah. You know, sometimes, right?

Elisa Ruer [: 00:28:42

Pick and soothe.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:43

Yeah.

Brad Herda [: 00:28:44

It's like we're the Millers. No regrets. Not even a letter? Are you sure? Just with a tattoo.

Steven Doyle [: 00:28:53

No regrets, right?

Brad Herda [: 00:28:55

Exactly. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, your wisdom and the importance of the of the Fincen coming forward, as well as just letting people know that it's important to engage and find somebody that they can work with to get that knowledge and that expertise because it's going to eliminate a lot of risk.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:29:14

Thank you.

Brad Herda [: 00:29:15

Thank you for being here today and have a great rest of your week.

Elisa Ruer [: 00:29:18

You too. Thank you.

Brad Herda [: 00:29:20

Thank you for listening to Blue Collar B's brought to you by vision for business solutions and professional business Coaching, Inc. If you'd like to learn more on today's topic, just reach out to Steve Doyle or myself, Adherda. Please like share, rate and review this show as feedback is the only way we can get better. Let's keep blue collar businesses strong for generations to come.